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PWG Book Club

Professional Women’s Group’s Book Club will highlight books that teach practical skills for career advancement and life, and uplift voices of women and gender expansive individuals.

 

As a PWG member, you are welcome to suggest books for PWG Book Club to read.

 

By attending PWG Book Club, you agree to the terms in PWG Handbook and the following terms:

1. BE RESPECTFUL: USE “I” STATEMENTS, SHARE AIR TIME, DON’T INTERRUPT OTHERS

Depending on our lived experiences and our identities, we all have different lived experiences.

Please use “I” statements to share different points of view and please do not turn down other people’s opinions.

Before making a comment please ask yourself: “Is it helpful, true, or kind?” Feel free to use stickie notes and notepads to jot down notes while others are talking and share them with the group when it’s your turn to speak.

 

2. SHARE ONLY WHAT YOU FEEL COMFORTABLE SHARING AND KEEP IT CONFIDENTIAL

PWG Book Club is a safe place to share points of views or your own experiences. Please do not repeat other clients’ stories outside of PWG Book Club.

3. USE ACCESSIBILITY TOOLS AVAILABLE, IF YOU WOULD LIKE

Transcription and translation services are available. If you would like to use them, please ask Han-Bee at the beginning of the meeting to set it up for you. You also are welcome to use any of the meeting rooms if you need a moment to yourself.

4. BE ON TIME

We all know that life happens. Being on time the best you can helps the discussions go more smoothly at the Book Club.

5. ENJOY THE COMMUNITY

Meet other employed women and gender expansive individuals regularly, build connections and your professional network, and make friends.

Our First Book Club Meeting was on Saturday, August 15th 10am-12pm at DFSO's WorkWell. We discussed The Next Conversation: Argue Less, Talk More by Jefferson Fisher.

LITTLERBOOKS: The Next Conversation: Argue Less, Talk More Summary

https://littlerbooks.com/summary/next-conversation

 

Bullet Point Summary and Quotes

  1. Winning an argument is a losing strategy because winning often comes at the cost of the other person's trust, respect, and the overall relationship. The true goal of a disagreement should be getting to the core issue, not to prove a point.

  2. The person you see is often not the person you are truly talking to. Their outward behavior, such as anger or defensiveness, is often driven by hidden personal struggles. Effective communication involves looking past the surface-level conflict to understand what is really motivating them.

  3. Conflict should be viewed as an opportunity for connection rather than a battle to be won.

  4. Choose curiosity and empathy over defensiveness. Remove any adversarial dynamic by trying to understand the other person's fears and hopes.

  5. Your next conversation is the most important one because it offers a chance to correct wrongs and build a better connection.

    1. “You can change everything in your next conversation.”

  6. Conversations often fail because of unrealistic goals, such as expecting an immediate apology or for the other person to completely adopt your viewpoint.

  7. Before entering a difficult conversation, define your personal values to yourself, like kindness or honesty, and use them to help you navigate conflict without sacrificing your integrity.

  8. Modern communication, like texting or emailing, is information transmission, not genuine connection.

  9. True connection is a two-part process requiring both internal understanding and external acknowledgment. It is not about always agreeing, but about creating a conduit for honest communication, whether the subject is positive or negative.

  10. Connection is hurt by three common failures: a lack of self-awareness of one's own signals, a lack of understanding of the other person's perspective, and a lack of self-assurance, which leads to indirect and passive communication.

  11. Arguments consist of two physiological phases: an ignition phase driven by the body's fight-or-flight response, which suppresses rational thought and leads to destructive communication, and a cooling phase where the body calms down, allowing for reflection.

  12. The ignition phase is caused by triggers, which are often psychological threats to one's identity (e.g., competence or autonomy), social standing (fear of judgment), or the fear of loss (of a relationship or status).

  13. The key to managing conflict is to first understand your own triggers and physiological reactions. This self-awareness also allows you to recognize triggers in others.

    1. “When you reverse engineer your own triggers, you'll become more skilled at identifying the triggers of others. You'll begin to hear someone's raised voice not as an attack but as a plea to remove the threat. If you want to put out their fire, find their trigger.”

  14. The most critical time to control a conflict is right before the ignition of an argument.

  15. To prevent the ignition, use a conversational breath, a quick scan, and a small talk.

    1. Conversational breath: inhale deeply twice through your nose, then long exhale. Repeat. This keeps your mind clear.

    2. Quick scan: identify physical and mental states and label them.

    3. Small talk: mentally repeat a short action-based phase (e.g, “Find the heart of it.” “Stand firm.”).

  16. Rushing your speech can be a sign of anxiety and can lead to mistakes. By deliberately slowing down, you can shift from an emotional reaction to a more logical and considered response.

  17. A well-timed pause can add weight to your words and demonstrate that you are in control of your emotions and the conversation.

    1. “It's like using the brakes on a car: controlling the speed of the interactions lets you safely steer it toward a more constructive outcome.”

    2. Short pauses (1-4 seconds) are effective for adding emphasis and showing that you are considering your answer, making you appear more deliberate and credible.

    3. Long pauses (5-10 seconds) are useful for causing the other person to reflect on their own words, which is effective when dealing with insults or dishonesty.

  18. Confidence is a feeling. Assertiveness is an action. You cannot decide to feel confident on command, as confidence is an emotional response. However, by practicing assertive behaviors, such as speaking directly and clearly, you create a positive feedback loop that builds confidence.

  19. To be more assertive: eliminate minimizing words (e.g, "just," "sorry"), clearly state your needs with "I" statements, use silence instead of filler words, and end sentences with a downward inflection to sound more assured.

  20. To handle difficult people, do not give the emotional reaction the other person is seeking. Instead of responding with anger, use long pauses, ask the person to repeat what they said, and use questions that focus on their intent or the desired outcome of their words (e.g., "Did you want that to hurt?"). This removes their power and forces them to reflect on their own behavior.

  21. When faced with non-apologies like "I'm sorry you feel that way" or "I'm sorry if I upset you," respond by correcting the language to focus on their behavior (e.g., "Don't apologize for my feelings, apologize for what you did."). This prevents them from sidestepping responsibility.

  22. To stop interruptions, allow the first one, then calmly use the person's name and an "I" statement (e.g., "Bob, I will listen to you when I'm finished.")

  23. When disagreeing, avoid confrontational language and instead frame your position as a different perspective (e.g., "I see things differently.”)

  24. Learning to say "no" effectively is fundamental to setting boundaries.

    1. First state the "no" directly, then express gratitude for the offer, and conclude with a kind remark.

    2. To set strong boundaries, identify what is most important to you (e.g., family, health, self-respect), then communicate these values to others.

  25. To enforce a boundary:

    1. Use an "I" statement to assert your limit (e.g., "I don't accept disrespect").

    2. Clearly outline what will happen if it's crossed ("If you continue, I will end this conversation").

    3. Take that action if necessary to demonstrate that you mean what you say.

  26. A conversational frame sets focus for a conversation to prevent it from becoming unproductive. To effectively frame a conversation:

    1. State the topic.

    2. Define the desired outcome.

    3. Get the other person's commitment.

  27. If the discussion gets off-topic or someone tries to deflect, acknowledge their point and then calmly redirect the focus back to the agreed-upon subject.

  28. Defensiveness is a self-protective reaction to feeling threatened or criticized. It causes people to interrupt, not listen, make personal attacks, or deflect blame.

  29. To counteract defensiveness in yourself, you should pause, let go of the need to respond immediately, and become curious about the other person's perspective.

  30. To prevent defensiveness in others, you can frame statements starting with "I" instead of "you," ask "what" or "how" instead of an accusatory "why," and acknowledge their point of view before presenting your own.

  31. "When you learn not to attend every argument you're invited to, you can prevent the wall from coming between you and the other person and preserve connection."

  32. For difficult conversations:

    1. Set a dedicated time and place.

    2. Be direct and start with your main point and the nature of the conversation (e.g., "This is going to be hard to hear"). Starting with small talk can come across as insincere.

  33. When someone starts a difficult conversation with you, acknowledge their courage (e.g., "Thank you for telling me").

    1. Avoid immediately shifting the focus to your own experiences. Instead, ask for permission before sharing what you've learned from similar situations.

  34. “If I had to condense these pages to a forty-seven-second video to post on social media for you, it would sound something like this:

    1. Number one: Never win an argument, or you'll lose a lot more than you gain. When you regulate your reactions before responding, you keep a clear head and a calm mind.

    2. Number two: Confidence isn't an act, it's an outcome. Use words and short phrases that assert your needs and protect your values without fear of disappointment. When you embrace your assertive voice, you make a pathway for more positive change in your life.

    3. Number three: Don't worry yourself over how to change an entire relationship. Focus on changing the next conversation. When you frame a conversation as something to learn, rather than something to prove, you take out the difficulty in building connection.”

Screenshot 2026-08-07 at 4.38.06 PM.png

The Next Conversation   by Jefferson Fisher

Summary:

In The Next Conversation, Fisher, a trial lawyer-turned communication coach, draws on years of high-pressure interactions to teach mindful communication techniques that work in real life. His central idea is simple but powerful: your goal in a hard conversation is not to “win” the argument—it’s to set the stage for the next conversation to be better.

The book is filled with actionable strategies for:

  • Staying calm in arguments and not taking the bait

  • Using intentional pauses to choose better words

  • Listening fully instead of planning your rebuttal

  • Setting boundaries in conversations without creating hostility

  • Recognizing when silence can be the strongest response

Fisher writes in short, digestible chapters, pairing clear language with relatable examples. Whether you’re navigating workplace conflict, a tense family dinner, or relationship disagreements, his approach is both practical and compassionate.

K8 Therapy: https://www.k8-therapy.com/blog/the-next-conversation-book-review

 

 

 

Three Communication Rules

Rule 1: Say it with Control means managing your emotions. Before you can change a conversation, you must control your own reactions.

Control Yourself First

Understanding what happens in your body during fights helps you stay in control. Fisher explains arguments have two phases. There’s ignition (fight-or-flight) and cooling (rest-and-digest). During ignition, your brain signals danger. Stress hormones release. Clear thinking stops.

Fisher gives three tools for those critical moments:

Tool 1: Special Breathing. Breathe in through your nose (2 seconds). Take another quick breath (1 second). Breathe out slowly (6 seconds). This calms your nervous system.

Tool 2: Body Check. Check your body for tension. Name your main emotion. Say internally, “I can tell I’m getting upset.”

Tool 3: Helpful Self-Talk. Create a short phrase that centers you. Examples: “Seek to understand,” “Stay strong,” or recall good advice.

Rule 2: Say it with Confidence means speaking up for your needs clearly without being mean. This builds real confidence through action.

Build Confidence Through Action

You can’t just decide to feel confident. Confidence comes from taking action.

  1. Every word matters: Remove weak words like “just” and “sort of”

  2. Express needs clearly: Start sentences with “I need”

  3. Say less: Fewer words create stronger messages

  4. Remove filler words: Replace “ums” with silence

  5. Don’t put yourself down: Avoid “This might sound stupid”

  6. Declare confidence: Start with “I’m confident” when talking about your abilities.

Tone matters: Sound balanced and controlled. Speak clearly at a steady pace.

 

Rule 3: Say it to Connect means making sure you understand each other. You want real connection, especially in sensitive talks.

Frame Conversations Clearly

Like a picture frame sets borders, conversation framing keeps talks focused and on track.

How to Frame Any Tough Talk

  1. Set clear direction: State the topic (“I want to discuss yesterday’s feedback”)

  2. Explain the goal: Share what you want (“I want us to work better together”)

  3. Get agreement: Ask if they’re okay with this (“Sound good?”)

One topic rule: Focus on one issue per conversation. This keeps things clear and respects everyone’s time.

Stay on track: If you get off topic, apologize and return. If they get off topic, acknowledge briefly then redirect: “I hear you. Let me finish what we started.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Conversational Breath: Use Strategic Silence

Fisher uses two types of pauses:

Short pauses (1-4 seconds) add emphasis to important words. They show you’re thoughtful and in control.

Long pauses (5-10 seconds) make the other person think about what they just said. These work great with rude or dishonest people. The silence makes them uncomfortable and they often correct themselves.

Strategic silence isn’t weakness. It’s powerful. Rushing shows anxiety. Slowing down shows confidence.

 

Difficult People: Handle Difficult People Well

                                                                                                      

The core issue with difficult behavior: People who insult or belittle often seek a dopamine hit from eliciting a reaction or feeling a sense of power. Difficult people want emotional reactions. Don’t give them that.

Tactics for common bad behaviors:

For insults: Use a long pause. Slowly repeat what they said. Keep breathing. This makes their words echo and they reconsider.

For talking down to you: Make them repeat it (“Say that again”) or ask about intent (“Did you want to hurt me?”).

For being rude: Ask about intent (“Did you mean to sound rude?”) and wait for their answer.

For interrupting: Let them interrupt once. Use their name to get attention. Then correct them: “I can’t hear you when you interrupt. Let me finish.”

Key rule: Stand firm but be respectful. How you respond sets the standard for how others treat you.

Set Healthy Boundaries

Many people can’t say “no” because they learned to put others’ comfort first. This leads to being overwhelmed, angry, and hurt relationships.

How to Say No Well

  1. Say no clearly first (“I can’t,” “I need to say no”) without long explanations

  2. Show thanks (“Thanks for thinking of me”) to keep the relationship good

  3. End kindly (“Hope it goes well!”) to stay connected

 

Making Boundaries Stick

  1. Start with the boundary: “I don’t accept how you’re treating me”

  2. Add consequences: “If you keep doing [behavior], I will [specific action]”

  3. Follow through: Only state consequences you’ll actually do

Some people will resist your new boundaries, especially if they benefited from your old ones. This discomfort means the boundary is working.

 

Navigate Really Tough Conversations

Some conversations are especially hard-giving bad news, discussing sensitive topics, or solving big conflicts.

Three Rules for Hard Conversations

Rule 1: Set aside real time. Pick a private, comfortable place where nobody feels rushed.

Rule 2: Skip small talk. When giving hard news, trying to “soften it” with chat can feel fake and increase worry. Be direct: “This will be hard to hear.”

Rule 3: Start with your main point. Lead with your key message instead of building up to it. This keeps the listener focused.

 

When Others Come to You

  • Welcome them: “I’m glad you came to me”

  • Ask one open question: “How are you feeling about that?”

  • Ask before sharing: “Can I share something?”

  • Offer experience, not orders: “Can I tell you what I’ve learned?”

Remember: Hard conversations are great chances to deepen connections when handled well.

SOURCES

The Next Conversation Workbook by Jefferson Fisher  Tarcher Press 2026   ISBN 979-8-217-04790-1

LITTLERBOOKS: The Next Conversation: Argue Less, Talk More Summary

https://littlerbooks.com/summary/next-conversation

https://vocal.media/bookclub/the-next-conversation-by-jefferson-fisher

https://www.getstoryshots.com/books/the-next-conversation-summary/

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